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GM’s big bet: the Chevy VoltGM hopes to shoot the moon with a car that many industry watchers say just isn’t possible.
The Atlantic has a fun piece on GM’s ambitious plan to bring the Volt to market by 2010. I generally don’t go in for overripe tales of corporate heroism, and I definitely don’t go in for economic nationalism, but hell if the story didn’t make me want to hoist up an American flag and blast the Mellencamp from the transistor radio in my ‘68 Chevelle:
Doesn’t sound like a big deal, perhaps, but most industry watchers seem to think GM’s goal simply isn’t possible with today’s technology. And, in fact, they’re right: GM has basically placed all their chips on the table, betting that they can develop a radically new car and a radically new battery simultaneously. It’s an inspiring and somewhat desperate act from a company that has been better known for its missteps and setbacks in recent years. While the engineering is no doubt impressive, the most brilliant thing about the Volt seems to be the publicity campaign — and I mean that in the best possible way. By opening up their normally secretive product design process to outside scrutiny, GM has practically turned the car — which doesn’t even exist yet — into a consumer movement. Buyers are practically willing this thing into existence. It’s hard not to root for the beleaguered giant. The author of the article thinks that GM will probably not quite succeed, but come close enough. Dates will slip a bit, prices will rise, but not so far or so high that the Volt becomes GM’s latest public flop. Here’s the great thing, though: it doesn’t really matter if the Volt itself is the car that pushes electric drivetrains to the mass market. The competition — Toyota, BMW, Nissan, Tesla — have taken notice. I hope not to own a car for a good long time, but I’m pretty sure when I do, it’ll be electric. Image by Flickr user johnny_nissan. Comments
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I've never been a huge fan of the General, but I am rooting for them now. They are not quite betting the company on this car, but it's a huge gamble, and the right one.
In other news, some of the smaller GM cars are pretty good. The Cobalts that I keep renting while on business travel (offset, of course) reminds me of my late-80's Hondas (in a good way- those cars were cheap, reliable, got good mileage, and handled reasonably well).
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Love the volt, 640 miles on a full tsnk, what's not to love?? Saw some great details on http://www.chevy-volt.net
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640 miles on a tank might sound good -- about the same as a Mercedes E-class deisel? -- but surely the important figure is 40 miles on a charge. While enough for most commutes, this is not partcularly ambitious, especially as GM says it is waiting for a breathrough in battery technology to achieve even this. And once you've done the 40 miles, the other 600 is using good old gasoline.
By contrast, Honda Clarity does 280 miles on a hydrogen fill-up. Don't rule out the possibility that hydrogen fuel cells rather than batteries are the future for transport. (See my blog on this today: http:\\tonysclimateblog.blogspot.com.)
Either way, we need clean electricity, and I think James Hansen was right to emphasise this rather than automobile drivetrains in his recent congressional testimony.
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[Ed. -- warning: ignorance and bigotry ahead!]
The Only Solution to the pandemic ENERGY CRISIS is EASY and SIMPLE. STOP the ENERGY WASTE !
Our energy waste is horrendous and tragic, thou easily FIXABLE !
America wastes over 60% of the energy it consumes. The Energy Waste is Everywhere !
(1) We over heat and over cool our homes, businesses, offices, schools, churches, etc...
(2) 10's of millions of outdoor lights burn during the day.
(3) Over packaging is the norm. Recycling is inadequate . Our landfills are busier than ever.
(4) Most Americans do not minimize their driving. Congestion is horrendous.
(5) Road construction in America is the ultimate contradiction.
The Only way to eliminate energy waste and over demand is by using the economic impact of taxing energy, in lieu of Federal Income Tax. Until the price of gas is $6 to $8 per gallon, hedonist America will not significantly reduce its over consumption and energy waste. Federal Gas Tax should be $4 to $6 per gallon and 'offset' by making Federal Income Tax begin at $60k.
Only with a tangible/dollar reward will America care to conserve. High energy costs are the only incentive by which renewable alternative energy supply will be developed.
In the mean time, the USA continues to give away its economic and political wealth to the Islamic Middle East via OPEC, just so we can continue our energy waste. Know that the Islamic dominated OPEC cartel is glad to allow supply and demand market forces to drive energy prices to $8/gallon.
[Ed. -- How nefarious! Using supply and demand to set prices! Americans would never stoop to this.]
The Islamics, who want to annihilate us, may succeed; using our American 'gas money' to buy the weapons needed to do so.
[Ed. -- wait, I'm pretty sure I've seen this movie. A View To A Kill? Goldfinger?]
China, India, and other 'developing countries' have just begun to compete for the world's remaining energy supply. Geopolitical unrest is directly related to global competition for energy and natural resources. If global demand for energy is not dramatically reduced, World war is inevitable.
[Ed. -- oh,right: Dr. Strangelove...]
Ford and General Motors are headed for bankruptcy, which will leave 100,000,000 Americans unemployed, ruin our economy, and lead to anarchy.
[Ed. -- um...everyone in America works for Ford and GM?]
America can no longer continue to 'do business as usual'. Ford and GM must quickly transition to the lucrative business of building solar and wind 'energy producers' for the world's 6.7 BILLION people reason$.
[Ed. -- I think they should start selling pies. Everyone loves pie!]
The world cannot continue to support all the automakers. We are running out of petroleum. Wake up !
Mass transit must reward those who reduce their driving and thereby become FREE, SAFE, CLEAN, and CONVENIENT. Only then, will significant numbers of people use it.
The incentive necessary to create a renewable and sustainable energy supply, will only occur when we implement the economics of TAXING ENERGY - NOT INCOME!
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Have you ever seen the documentary "Who Killed The Electric Car"? If not, I suggest you watch it. It says a lot about GM and their motive(s) behind their original electric car. I do not put a whole lot of trust in this latest endeavor... The bottom line here is that we need to get away from reliance on both electric and gas consumption and until we can curb our cravings for these two things we will continue on this path of utter destruction
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Why wait till 2010 for an electric vehicle? There are several available today, two of which are the ZAP, 40 mpg with a range of 35 miles, the other is the Zenn, with a from the factory 25mph and a range of 35-40 mph. The Zenn has a governor that can be reprogrammed to allow the car to go up to 40 mph. I made my Zenn purchase two weeks ago and am awaiting delivery next week.
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I really don't see why GM should have any problem getting this car on the road. In the mid ninties the EV-1 was mass produced and loved by those who were able to lease one. This was all done with lead acid batteries. battery technology has obviously improved look at the Tesla Roadster using lithium ion batteries. The technology is there it's more politics and greed that are slowing down moving this to the roadways
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I tend to agree with Tony Welsh. Isn't the real story the fuel cell with the Chevy Equinox? Why isn't this even mentioned in the article?
http://www.chevrolet.com/fuelcell/
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I'm looking forward to the development and (hopefully) proliferation of series hybrids like this one. It seems like buyers will need the "peace of mind" (extended range) that an extra reservoir of gasoline (or ethanol, diesel, natural gas, et cetera) can provide.
It turns out that throttling an internal combustion engine to drive wheels at various speeds is far less efficient then using the same engine to produce electricity for electrically driven wheels. When the engine is used only to produce electricity, you can run it at its peak efficiency (torque and RPM) only when you need it.
The technology is proven. Freight locomotives have been using this type of power train for decades (see diesel-electric locomotive).
It seems that the only major concern left is the battery...of course the Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle Research Center at UC Davis hasn't had too much battery trouble in their prototypes -- so maybe the batteries are not so much a technological hurdle as they are a lame excuse.
I see no reason why a car like the Volt should not be in production now.
Series hybrids are a good intermediate step -- they use existing technology and infrastructure (unlike hydrogen). They can wean us from fossil fuels and help us make the transition to fully electric vehicles.
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Adam -
Good grief, forbid it to be that you should be proud of and root for your country or its industries as a first impulse.
As for the Volt - hope it works, or comes close. Thanks for giving the project some attention.
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You got questions, we got (some) answers:
- Eliminating waste is laudable but it is not sufficient to meet the needs of a developing world. Nine billion people with a Western standard of living, even at twice today's energy efficiency, would still need four times as much energy as the world uses today. We need to replace all fossil fuels with non-fossil energy sources, and we need to start right now.
- Zap and Zenn sell glorified golf carts. More power to them, but niche market products which few people buy do not help very much.
- Hydrogen fuel cells will never be part of the solution because it is now, and always will be, easier and cheaper to make and deploy electricity and batteries than hydrogen and fuel cells.
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If GM manages to get the Volt out on time, it will mean that in just 11 years, they will have managed to go from a car capable of going 150 miles on a charge to a car capable of going 40 miles on a charge.
Way to go GM.
May GM die a slow painful corporate death to be replaced by the likes of Tesla Motors.
http://www.teslamotors.com/
GM as a company had a huge edge in electric vehicles but deliberately crushed them all and stopped production. Instead they lobbied against California's clean air laws and won. I have no sympathy for these bastards.
The U.S. manufacturers like to whine that you can't make a profit building cars in the U.S. Meanwhile, as GM closes plants, Toyota opens new ones ... here ... in the U.S. where cars can't be produced at a profit.
These people make me physically ill.
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As a solar energy consultant I am getting more and more requests from customers who want slighlty larger solar systems than they need for thier house now, so they can charge up their electric cars when these become available, and it looks like it won't be long now...
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I guess I should have posted a link about the car to which I referred in my prior post. Check out the EV-1 that GM built in 1999. It scared Toyota. The electric motor Toyota built in response to this great American technology is now found in the Prius.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1
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If you're interested in charging your electric car with a solar electric system and live in California, Oregon, Colorado, New Jersey or Hawaii, look us up!
http://www.recsolar.com
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Richard has it right about fuel cells. Hydrogen faces some serious, serious hurdles.
1. Most h2 is produced using steam reformation of natural gas or other hydrocarbons. The byproducts are H2 and CO2.
2. H2 produced using electrolysis is inherently inefficient - about 40% of the energy makes H2 the rest is waste heat.
3. Storing and transporting H2 is expensive - all fittings (valves etc.) have to have super-high tolerances to prevent the molecules rom escaping. Super-cooling is the only way to store it in large quantities, requiring massive amounts of energy.
4. Infrastructure. Where can I get my H2 refill?
Electric vehicles have only one hurdle to jump - battery capacity. Side by side, electrics win out. If you replace the recip. generator on a Volt with a biofuel-burning engine, you have 0 net carbon emissions at much higher efficiency and lower cost - both in vehicle cost and infrastructure investment- than H2 fuel cell vehicles.
If we transition our electricity production to wind, PV, solar thermal, and nuclear we can achieve a 0 carbon emission society. We just need the political will and willingness to sacrifice in the near-term.
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why are we so excited about electric when much of it comes from coal? isn't the idea to cut out greenhouse gases (carbon?) - or has it just become getting more mileage?
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#17 - Ionna,
Electricity can be produced from renewable sources. This makes electric cars a step toward getting rid of fossil fuels.
Further, since gasoline motors are only 35-40% efficient and electric motors are about 80% efficient, even if all of our cars were changed to electric AND all of the power came from coal, we would still reduce GHGs produced by our fleet by about a third.
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why are we so excited about electric when much of it comes from coal? isn’t the idea to cut out greenhouse gases (carbon?) - or has it just become getting more mileage?
Is anyone here still buying coal power? Just about every major utility has a green energy program nowadays.
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To add to Misanthropic Scott's point, once we've reconnected our transport system to the grid via electric cars, which already makes it cleaner, we can then _incrementally_ replace the dirty current grid with a cleaner one, as time, resources, and politics permit.
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In light of the history of the EV-1, I'll believe the Volt isn't simply a case of major corporate greenwashing when it is actually produced AND made generally available.
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It's helpful to read the article linked at the top, "GM's ambitious plan".
Here's a sample: To deliver tens of thousands of vehicles in 2010, [the battery expert] said, "they should have had hundreds of them already driving around for two or three years. Hundreds. ....." An executive with a GM competitor, [also said]: 'They're making a huge mistake.'
I'm glad GM is making the gamble. They could succeed. Another scenario: they WANT to fail, then can say, "See it doesn't work, until we have $10/gallon of gas." But if they WANT to produce the car a year late and it doesn't sell, by then Toyota could make GM look like idiots.
That's the risk if they WANT to fail! Maybe the US engineers with Honda/Toyota/Nissan will build a consumer product, instead of GM's strawman, er uh: strawCAR! So the competition sells cars, improves their image, with GM looking like Chrysler.
However, here's 2 quotes telling the reverse scenario: "With the Volt, GM 'battered, beleaguered, struggling for profitability' hopes to re-engineer not just the car but the way the public thinks about cars...." Seems like the writer can't guess who the heros will be.
Later: GM was backing the Hummer, [hide your head in shame!] 'Everyone's thinking the same thing: We've got to turn this thing around,' one executive told me. 'We've got to get our mojo back on advanced technology. ..." On page 2, one GM engineer compares GM to Apple, they both were on their last breath, nearly dead. For Apple, the iPod made the rest of Apple products LOOK RELEVANT. Maybe it means that a cool electric car will help them sell SUV's.
In 2015, if 10% of their sales are Volts and Volt cousins, then GM could dominate the domestic SUV sales. I'm guessing that $10 gas means they only sell SUV hybrids to folks with kids who take short trips. [What's wrong with a Volvo station wagon?]
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Above comment by Michael Knight, is _S_O_ true, and frankly discouraging to me. In the USA [my only home], our GLUTTONOUS energy habits won't change until the price is right. The GM Volt looks great, and cars can change the glut in 5 to 10 years. However, consider our housing energy waste. This takes much longer to change.
I'm looking for bumper stickers that say, "I am not a GLUTTON." My city govt took a step to encourage smart resources. Among other factoids: "Every ton of plastic bottles recycled saves about 3.8 barrels of oil." It makes me wonder what 10 bottles are worth, at oil prices of $200 per barrel.
Also:"Motor oil is forever recylable, it only gets DIRTY." I read somewhere else that a small percentage is ever recycled. Imagine oil tankers of dirty oil going into a landfill!
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Good discussion. I'll have another post up soon on hydrogen.
Coupla quick points --
First, I'm not sure where this notion comes from that the Volt could have been built ten years ago, or that the technology is sitting on a shelf somewhere, but it's kinda silly. No, the EV-1 was not the same as a Volt. Yes, the problem GM is trying to solve is hard -- and crucial if electric vehicles are going to achieve mainstream adoption.
Second, this whole question over whether GM is "greenwashing" or whether their past actions were honorable is kind of irrelevant. Someone is going to bring an electric car successfully to mass market.* I personally don't really care who it is or what their motives. I'm just rooting for it to happen as soon as possible. GM seems to be staking out a leadership position in that race, so good for them. And good for Tesla and all the other companies chasing the same prize.
* I love the Tesla Roadster, but it's not a mass market vehicle.
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The EV-1 battery packs did not last the lifetime of the vehicle and required regular replacement. This was part of the reason that (supposedly) GM refused to sell them is that they would have to continue to produce battery packs for them, and they were extremely expensive.
The EV-1 did not have the safety standards people expect from their vehicles today. The standards have, more or less, doubled the weight of vehicles. There are lighter materials that could be used, but that would drive up the cost of the vehicle dramatically.
Ultimately, the problem comes down to batteries. GM has to develop a battery system that will last a vehicle lifetime (at least 10 years), and handle a variety of charging situations. This is much more tricky than it seems since different battery types handle different types of charges better. For example, on the Prius, the batteries stop supplying electricity long before they are ever 'dry' so the batteries will last the lifetime of the vehicle.
However, the major difference between the Prius and the Volt is that the Volt can be charged many different ways (plug in, small bits with regeneritive breaking, and while running with the generator), whereas the current Prius is only charged in small bits.
While I look forward to the Volt, I suppose I would be more excited if there would be a version without the generator. That will add serious weight to the vehicle that the electric engine will have to overcome at all times, and ultimately reduces the overall range of the vehicle. If they could create a version that is electric only at ~100 miles per charge, that would be a vast improvement, in my opinion. That said, GM is clearly thinking long-term and having a fleet of vehicles all running with a motor instead of an engine, so I can not blame them for pursuing this route.
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The better option for electric car is going to be the Aptera at the end of this year for under $30k. Only available in CA at the moment, but all electric and 120 mile range. I would never by the Volt after seeing "Who killed the electric car".
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People keep bringing up the EV1, but that thing had considerable drawbacks. It cost $30-40K, and took eight hours of charging for that 50-150 mile range (depending on model). That's fine if you're just using it to commute and run errands, but suppose you have to get from San Francisco to L.A.; even the best EV1's make this a multi-day trip. And the infamous recall? That was because the charging apparatus could overheat and catch fire. Sixteen incidents reported, one car destroyed, out of the 1,100 cars ever produced. If we inflate that out to 500,000 units nationwide (slightly less than the Prius), GM could find itself in serious legal trouble.
I wish GM all the luck in the world with the Volt. It's the third-party dark horse candidate of the automotive world; even if it doesn't succeed, it's gotten people talking about issues that matter. I would not be at all surprised if Toyota's recent attempts at next-gen batteries was motivated by the threat of a mostly-electric Volt. Gasoline, for all of its faults, provides an easily-refillable power source, and that makes the Volt more practical than the EV1 could ever be.
-- A.
Who Killed the Electric Car? does reveal some interesting things about GM, but as I recall, it also points a finger squarely at consumers for demanding perfection at a discount price.
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kind of stupid "cannot be done" uproach of this article. YES it can be done! its not hard, or "radically new".
NORMAL batteries, and normal electrical car. it has been already done - Fisker Karma for one - the principle of gas engine to keep feeding the batteries, el motor moves tehcar.
WHY is it taking this long, though? posssible great GM car, do it NOW.
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GM has screwed up so many times. To name but a few - kill electric cars; laughed at hybrid; laughed at Japanese cars as small and cheap toys when they first showed up; kept building big ass Hummer and Suburban. This may be the last chance for GM to right itself and do something useful for the environment and Americans. Let's cheer for them, keep watching them to make sure that they deliver. Volt is revolutionary so it may not be perfect when it first comes out of the gate. But Americans and the environment cannot afford it to fail.
Without cutting 80% carbon emission by 2020, the world may as well as car manufacturers to build boats because sea level will rise by 10 meters.
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Volt is going in the right direction. Hydrogen does not make sense when compared to electricity. GM has been destroying itself by management stupidity for many years. Let's hope that saner heads who see the future as electric will prevail. If they get Volt to market, I'll buy one. The Aptera is a better car, but not a mass market vehicle because of radical looks--people are silly enough to decide on a car by how it looks, rather than how it works.
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Walter (#23):
If you don't find a bumper sticker you like, you could always make your own. Just enter "custom bumper stickers" into your search engine of choice. There's plenty of shops out there.
-- A.
Just to be safe, you may want to add "no minimum order."
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One more note. how do current hybrids /30-55mpg/ stack against say VW Polo diesel at cca 50mpg, VW Jetta diesel at 45mpg, FIAT 500 at 60-70 mpg /official data/? its a lot of battery to make for a hybrid.
APTERA - good, great, but the issue here is of safety - where is air bags, crumple zones, ESP/ABS?
I DO believe in a Plug In Electric (pure - el motor only to power wheels), with on board gas/diesel/natural gas battery generator.
This should give you over 100 mpg /Volt/ .. DO oil concerns ~want~ it?! no. ... thats why it takes so long for it. that's why $1b for GM EV1 at $20k 20 years ago, only to be "scrapped" as "undoable".
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The article states that the Volt is innovative because it is electric with a gas engine only as a boost. This is what the Prius does already; the gasoline engine only runs when it is needed. This may be a lot of the time, but my Prius can run for extended periods on the electric motor only under the right conditions. Most other hybrids, like my former Honda Insight, do what the article states: they run on the gasoline engine all the time and use the battery as a boost.
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Arrakis, there are two differences between Prius and Volt. When in use, the Prius's gasoline engine drives the wheels directly, in parallel with the electric motor. The Volt engine is used only to charge the battery, so in theory can be run at its optimal rpm whenever it is running. (On the other hand the double conversion of energy to and from electrical energy introduces its own inefficiencies.)
The second difference of course is that the Prius (as supplied by Toyota) cannot be charged from the grid, so all the power ultimately derives from burning gasoline.
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"Love the volt, 640 miles on a full tank, what’s not to love??"
The fact that it will be charged using coal power... :(
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The fact that it will be charged using coal power… :(
Does anyone here still buy coal power? Green electricity (mostly wind and biogas) costs a whopping 1.6c per kwh here in Michigan. They just constructed the states first wind farm earlier this year mostly because of demand from the green energy programs through the two major utilities.
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